Sad commentary on the modern world where my first thought was, well good for Orban to concede defeat. Not all current world heads of state have that much maturity.
This bodes well for the midterm state of the European union.
Pulling a Trump requires a polarized electorate where you are mostly going to have both parties in 48-52% range, with only real fights in few battleground states, and no absurd change in total vote %. Even Trump won't pull a Trump if other party was nearing 2/3rd majority. I am not even sure of what would happen to American politics if a party reaches 2/3rd majority in both houses, a list of long pending reforms might finally become possible.
It's worth noting that the party vote share here was 53% for Tisza vs. 44% for the even-more-right-wing parties. The fact that this results in a two thirds majority is because the electoral system inflates the strongest party. Orbán has previously achieved two thirds majorities multiple times while winning less than 50% of the party vote. Most seats are assigned not through party lists but in single-member constituencies with first-past-the-post voting, same as in America. So it's not "convince two thirds of the people to vote for you", it's "convince a very slim plurality in two thirds of the constituencies to vote for you".
I'd like that. But this system is very attractive for the strongest party, so it will be a real test of their commitment to actually representative, multi-party democracy. Also, the general system (a mix of single-member constituencies and party list seats, with more of the former than the latter) isn't a Fidesz invention, it has a long legal tradition in Hungary. So there might be a lot of resistance to a purer party-list system on those grounds too.
Obvious tweaks exist, of course: Even if you keep more individual constituencies than party list seats, they should use some sort of instant runoff/ranked choice/etc. system. But other first past the post countries are dragging their feet on this too, so... we'll see.
It's a bit like computer security: you have to get it right all of the time and the perps mostly only need one shot at being lucky and then it will takes many years to undo the damage.
We should approach democracy more with the kind of insight that go into making computers secure. Oh, wait...
From the perspective of a Canadian, this feels like an absolutely mad-cap crazy comment. What did you live through?
EDIT: with as little judgement as I'm sincerely trying to have, I would strongly recommend reviewing your information diet and neurotypical predispositions to investigate why you might believe this. (E.g. I am predisposed to support an underdog, and need to gutcheck myself on that regularly)
Sure. Just like Hitler offing himself; just an expression of trust in the system! "Oh no, I lost in the marketplace of ideas, time to make the ultimate concession!"
> I’ve never said that just because you’re invoking the Nazis you’re losing the argument. If you’re going to compare somebody to Hitler or the Nazis or raise the specter of the Holocaust, be sure you’ve got your facts right. But there’s nothing categorically wrong with Biden’s — or anyone else’s — comparison of Trump calling people vermin or talking about blood poisoning to Hitler.
Trump went because House/Senate Republicans at the time hadn't yet done the 180 they have since; the support wasn't there. It has nothing to do with his faith in the democratic process.
But in the end he went. The system worked exactly like it was supposed to. There is room to challenge results, that keeps the system honest. When he lost the challenges, he willingly stepped down.
This is exactly how the system is designed to work.
I understand the visceral hatred of Trump, but I don't know why every conversation about him has to degrade the same way this one has, with people using emotional-manipulation like evoking Hitler.
He tried for a redo of the Brooks Brothers Riot in the US Capitol. He demanded the Georgia governor change their result. He recruited a slate of fake electors.
In no world was his transition of power lawful and orderly.
Yeah, Trump is not normal, not playing normal politics. He's the worst form of opportunist.
Like yesterday, does anyone actually think he thought he was posting a meme about being a doctor? No, he was faith testing whether he could LARP as Jesus, and he couldn't. He's the fucking worst form of liar, as he even deceives himself. He's a mentally sick man, and a society that excuses his behavior is sick as well.
I vaguely recall a man giving a speech to a large group of people, urging Congress to not certify the election, and then those people storming the capitol, and then those people going to jail and being subsequently pardoned from jail from the guy who gave the speech.
I suspected he would lose when he was recently visited and supported by Vance. Nobody likes Vance (in Europe, and probably anywhere). Getting prominent backing by an unlikable character isn’t a winning strategy.
Also, the fact of faking a terror attack and everybody just shrugging it off as an obvious Russian false flag op. I think even Orbán understood at that point that the jig was up.
One thing that's surprised me over the last few years is how much Russia messes with global politics. It seems to seeping into public consciousness so instead of being seen as a bit of a conspiracy theory you now have the crowds shouting Russia out. I don't know if that'll effect other Russia backed projects like Brexit financed by Russia via Arron Banks and Trump, financed by the "We have all the funding we need out of Russia" stuff. It doesn't seem illegal but the voters may be getting fed up with it all?
Amazing news for EU! If Tisza can get supermajority after votes are counted then they can also easily reverse a lot of constitutional corruption in Hungary done by Orban.
My guess is it's flagged by Americans (it's their daytime) who don't realize the significance of this result to the EU and potentially the EU's response to the war in Ukraine.
You know, I took a second look at it, and weirdly enough, I can't vouch it for some reason. That's odd. Grats to the good folks across the pond though! May we be so lucky when next our transition is scheduled!
Probably flagged by MAGA and pro-Kremlin aligned accounts who dislike the results and uppercase Liberal limousine establishment Democrats who try to censor every view they don't already agree with. If these were normal times, the I'd say keep sex, religion, and politics private except not the latter when liberal democratic politicians, speech-debate, and journalism are/were under fire in many sectors and countries. I'm hoping with this result that Hungary will experience much greater press and personal freedom.. and the corruption will hopefully be exposed more widely similar to Caolan Robertson only hinting at some of the extravagant emoluments and embezzlement. https://youtu.be/HiayCdysN04
American here. I was at a party when I saw the news and gleefully announced it to the table I was sitting at. We were all pleased with both the result and the concession.
It is getting more and more difficult for me to see moderation here as unbiased. The charitable take is that people are often not aware of their biases. I am sure I suffer from that to some extent, though I really try to go out of my way to be self-aware about this. And yes, of course this comment could be evidence of my own bias.
This is just a straw man fallacy I keep seeing pushed around, especially on pro-Russia subs in reddit. Elections are about how you choose who takes the role, it's not about what the role is - which can be a fascist dictator with popular support. It is a popular genre in the last 10-15 years, the fascists and dictators with popular support use their control of media, police, judiciary etc to align all the odds in their favor and go ahead and hold real elections and as long as the margin is large enough they don't cheat on the elections.
Even when they loose an election they tend to have loyalists embedded deep in the institutions and take power back through sabotage and legal battles.
For example, they set the governing process in such a way that it's practically impossible to effectively govern by following the rules, when they loose an election the new people are having very hard time, services start to suffer. They need to do reforms and change the laws and if they don't have supermajority they are being blocked and end up either screw up governing or follow the practical paths of governing like the previous government used to do. This results in either losing elections next time as the public sees this as incompetence or being sent into jail as judiciary selectively targets you for corruption when you take shortcuts to get things done.
So it is a fascist dictatorship even if there are elections and official power transfer because the institution than wield power follow orders to smash opponents of their leader during their reign or even after they are officially not in power.
Good. I visited Hungary years ago, and I loved the time I spent there. It saddened me a bit to see its sliding into autocracy and being relegated to be a Russian vassal state.
Hopefully the damage Orban caused to Hugarian institutions get reversed.
Yes, that's true. But there is enough about Magyar that I don't understand that I'm cautiously optimistic. Though it would be hard to imagine worse than Orban...
JD Vance strikes again. I wonder how long it will take US politicians and assorted billionaires to realize that their 'endorsements' will backfire.
"...will take US politicians and assorted billionaires to realize that their 'endorsements' will backfire..."
They may have to switch off their AI and start using their own brain - should they still have one, that is.
For both: I prefer to see it all rather than to assume it will be fine. Oh, and we still have Fico to deal with. But at least Hungarians have chosen against Orban that in itself gives some hope. Those leaked phone calls that were made public in the last weeks were very damning, I always assumed that such stuff was going on but to have hard proof is on another level.
I wonder what they're going to do with the participants. And what Orban's plans are now that he's in the opposition. I would not count him out just yet, he's got Putin's backing and you can bet they'll work overtime to try to destabilize Magyar's government. The rot goes pretty deep and it will take a lot of work to undo all that damage.
Orban is only 63; it's up to him what he will do but there is a certain type of people that could live happily on their own island with all the money they have stolen but they prefer to do evil to their last day. See for example Babis, delegating the ownership of his huge company to a trust fund so he can be a prime minister again at 70. Or indeed our great leader Fico who is in politics like Orban since '89, was prime minister around 15 years of the last 20, probably stolen billions for himself, was shot, nearly killed, and doesn't look like he wants to give up his power anytime soon.. and he's still only 62.
If nothing goes catastrophically wrong (again), Orban won't be allowed to return as a prime minister. One of the first legislation the new government aims to pass is to maximize the number of terms to two (8 years in power) which Orban already surpassed. Of course, they could always pull a Putin and put him in a presidential chair and shift power from the parliament/prime minister, so let's hope Fidesz never gets that level of support ever again.
With Orban much reduced in power Fico's days are numbered.
But Orban will hang around, if only to do more of Putin's bidding, it's up to Magyar & the new government now to deal with Orban and his spies in a way that they won't be able to do a come-back.
Not really, Fico has survived a lot during his 4 decades in politics and was always able to adapt (to our detriment). His political survival does not depend on Orban, even though they were close the last couple of years.
That's absolutely true. But in a European context he's already vowed that he will now take up Orban's mantel in blockading EU assistance to Ukraine and other tricks. That means he will no longer be able to hide his involvement and I'm pretty sure that the same kind of conversations between Lavrov and Hungarian politicians can be found about Fico & company. They are clearly not acting in Slovakia's long term interests and that's something that can be much more openly discussed. Keeping in mind that Slovakia is only 1/3rd of so of the size economy as Hungary makes it less of a problem to begin with.
Strength to you, it must be super hard to be living under politicians that are ripping off your country in such a blatant manner on behalf of what is nominally now an enemy nation (based on their own statements), especially given what your country had to endure in the years before the fall of the USSR.
I think generally western EU has no idea how unbelievably corrupt these regimes (Fico, Orbana, Babis) are... they are not stealing on behalf of Putin, they are stealing for themselves, and they are oriented towards Russia because they dream of having Putin's unchecked power.
Luckily I don't think Fico will help Putin that much because nobody trusts him anymore, his foreign minister is very weak and as you mention Slovakia is no economical heavyweight. The hardest thing for us is to see the brainwashed masses still voting for Fico or worse still actual nazis.
Yes, he basically have the same views, except on Russia. One advantage though is that Orban put his people at the head of Hungary corporations, so maybe that will end and the corruption will be kept at "normal" levels.
Unfortunatlely, half democracies (ie representative) are open to abuse and give too much power to presidents or governments. Combined with populism, lobbying and corruption, it allows people like Orban to stay in power for a long time. Glad it's over.
which balance? orban was a parasite, trying to embezzle as much money from the EU without getting the boot (hungary as the biggest per-head receiver of EU funds), while probably also getting paid by russia - a hostile actor - for his actions (i.e. sabotaging the union and sowing dissent through propaganda). there was no balance there.
It all seems so easy, despite the efforts of Putin and the US to support a guy that was there for almost two decades. I wonder if the incumbent party is, somehow, in the pocket of those fascists. I have a hard time accepting they’d just shrug and move on from being able to control a puppet state that’s the thorn in EU’s side.
Any reason not to be so cynical? I am unfamiliar with the details of Hungarian politics, but I can’t help wondering if it is staged. And why would Orbán just roll over after all this time in power?
> I have a hard time accepting they’d just shrug and move on from being able to control a puppet state that’s the thorn in EU’s side.
What can they realistically do? Invade Hungary?
> And why would Orbán just roll over after all this time in power?
What can he realistically do? A coup? With such a devastating defeat this would only lead to massive protests, which would completely ruin his political career. Meanwhile he can take a step back and think how to get back to the game in the next election.
As bad as Orban was, and as manipulated the election process was, he always won using legit votes. Which was both his strength and his weakness.
I knew the projections were looking really grim for Orban after watching JD Vance putting Trump on speakerphone five days ago during his Hungary visit. That was awkward.
What? 4$ gas until November Mr.President? Who doesn’t love paying 30% more for Gas out of their pocket for a war that is already won. Tremendous work Mr. President. A capital V victory.
> My Administration stands ready to use the full Economic Might of the United States to strengthen Hungary’s Economy, as we have done for our Great Allies in the past, if Prime Minister Viktor Orbán and the Hungarian People ever need it. We are excited to invest in the future Prosperity that will be generated by Orbán’s continued Leadership! President DONALD J. TRUMP
edit: OP's post originally complained that this was Soros's fault.
Let's see Trump standing by his word and help strengthen Hungary's economy now that the Russian Stooge has lost. So much for that continued leadership.
I have not read much about this issue, but I wonder if it is as serious as you are saying why are populations across Europe not voting against it, or they are voting but getting ignored by the rulers?
> or they are voting but getting ignored by the rulers?
That is what happened in at least:
- the Netherlands (votes for Wilders)
- Sweden (votes for SD)
- Germany (votes for AfD)
- France (votes for whatever that party is called nowadays)
- the UK (votes for Brexit largely based around migration issues)
- Belgium (votes for Vlaams Blok)
- Italy (votes for Meloni)
- Austria (votes for FPÖ)
...and I can go on. In most countries in Europe voters have spoken out against what they consider to be excessive asylum-based migration from non-Western cultures without requirements regarding assimilation or integration but not much has happened politically until very recently when the EU parliament voted to increase deportation efforts [1]. It remains to be seen whether this law will have any measurable impact given the fact that the EU actively supports many NGOs which aim to achieve the opposite of what the law states.
Sad commentary on the modern world where my first thought was, well good for Orban to concede defeat. Not all current world heads of state have that much maturity.
This bodes well for the midterm state of the European union.
Peaceful transition of power is definitely something to cheer about.
Sadly so. In the last decades it was just normal for almost all countries. It's kind of maddening how low Trump lowered the bar for politicians.
As a fellow European this is the biggest surprise of the election, I thought for sure he'd pull a Trump.
Pulling a Trump requires a polarized electorate where you are mostly going to have both parties in 48-52% range, with only real fights in few battleground states, and no absurd change in total vote %. Even Trump won't pull a Trump if other party was nearing 2/3rd majority. I am not even sure of what would happen to American politics if a party reaches 2/3rd majority in both houses, a list of long pending reforms might finally become possible.
It's worth noting that the party vote share here was 53% for Tisza vs. 44% for the even-more-right-wing parties. The fact that this results in a two thirds majority is because the electoral system inflates the strongest party. Orbán has previously achieved two thirds majorities multiple times while winning less than 50% of the party vote. Most seats are assigned not through party lists but in single-member constituencies with first-past-the-post voting, same as in America. So it's not "convince two thirds of the people to vote for you", it's "convince a very slim plurality in two thirds of the constituencies to vote for you".
Let's hope they fix that little loophole before the next election.
I'd like that. But this system is very attractive for the strongest party, so it will be a real test of their commitment to actually representative, multi-party democracy. Also, the general system (a mix of single-member constituencies and party list seats, with more of the former than the latter) isn't a Fidesz invention, it has a long legal tradition in Hungary. So there might be a lot of resistance to a purer party-list system on those grounds too.
Obvious tweaks exist, of course: Even if you keep more individual constituencies than party list seats, they should use some sort of instant runoff/ranked choice/etc. system. But other first past the post countries are dragging their feet on this too, so... we'll see.
It's a bit like computer security: you have to get it right all of the time and the perps mostly only need one shot at being lucky and then it will takes many years to undo the damage.
We should approach democracy more with the kind of insight that go into making computers secure. Oh, wait...
Also an election system designed for horseback.
I think it's pretty damn brilliant. I see the failure to maintain it as intended as the real shortcoming.
If anyone can bring about enough disappointment and disgust for 2/3 of the population to vote Democrat, it is Trump.
Getting arrested after losing an election? Or getting arrested as an opposition candidate in an election which he later won?
Seems like it was a clear reference to January 6.
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We're just gonna pretend Jan 6 never happened, eh?
He claimed the 2020 election was stolen again yesterday.
From the perspective of a Canadian, this feels like an absolutely mad-cap crazy comment. What did you live through?
EDIT: with as little judgement as I'm sincerely trying to have, I would strongly recommend reviewing your information diet and neurotypical predispositions to investigate why you might believe this. (E.g. I am predisposed to support an underdog, and need to gutcheck myself on that regularly)
[flagged]
Sure. Just like Hitler offing himself; just an expression of trust in the system! "Oh no, I lost in the marketplace of ideas, time to make the ultimate concession!"
[flagged]
Good news!
https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2023/12/19/godwins-la...
> I’ve never said that just because you’re invoking the Nazis you’re losing the argument. If you’re going to compare somebody to Hitler or the Nazis or raise the specter of the Holocaust, be sure you’ve got your facts right. But there’s nothing categorically wrong with Biden’s — or anyone else’s — comparison of Trump calling people vermin or talking about blood poisoning to Hitler.
Trump went because House/Senate Republicans at the time hadn't yet done the 180 they have since; the support wasn't there. It has nothing to do with his faith in the democratic process.
> Trump went because...
But in the end he went. The system worked exactly like it was supposed to. There is room to challenge results, that keeps the system honest. When he lost the challenges, he willingly stepped down.
This is exactly how the system is designed to work.
I understand the visceral hatred of Trump, but I don't know why every conversation about him has to degrade the same way this one has, with people using emotional-manipulation like evoking Hitler.
He tried for a redo of the Brooks Brothers Riot in the US Capitol. He demanded the Georgia governor change their result. He recruited a slate of fake electors.
In no world was his transition of power lawful and orderly.
Yeah, Trump is not normal, not playing normal politics. He's the worst form of opportunist.
Like yesterday, does anyone actually think he thought he was posting a meme about being a doctor? No, he was faith testing whether he could LARP as Jesus, and he couldn't. He's the fucking worst form of liar, as he even deceives himself. He's a mentally sick man, and a society that excuses his behavior is sick as well.
> But in the end he went.
Sure. Again, so did Hitler.
He went because the alternative was being dragged out by the FBI and Secret Service like a toddler having a tantrum.
> I don't know why every conversation about him has to degrade the same way this one has
Maybe if your self-described information diet included a little news and electoral coverage you wouldn't be so flat-footed by it.
"Your honor I am only accused of attempted murder."
> there was the normal transfer of power
ok...
I vaguely recall a man giving a speech to a large group of people, urging Congress to not certify the election, and then those people storming the capitol, and then those people going to jail and being subsequently pardoned from jail from the guy who gave the speech.
Except of course for the little bit where he instructed his VP to not certify the elections.
Trump still to this day has not admitted he lost against biden
No, this is not sad commentary on the modern world.
I suspected he would lose when he was recently visited and supported by Vance. Nobody likes Vance (in Europe, and probably anywhere). Getting prominent backing by an unlikable character isn’t a winning strategy.
Also, the fact of faking a terror attack and everybody just shrugging it off as an obvious Russian false flag op. I think even Orbán understood at that point that the jig was up.
One thing that's surprised me over the last few years is how much Russia messes with global politics. It seems to seeping into public consciousness so instead of being seen as a bit of a conspiracy theory you now have the crowds shouting Russia out. I don't know if that'll effect other Russia backed projects like Brexit financed by Russia via Arron Banks and Trump, financed by the "We have all the funding we need out of Russia" stuff. It doesn't seem illegal but the voters may be getting fed up with it all?
Amazing news for EU! If Tisza can get supermajority after votes are counted then they can also easily reverse a lot of constitutional corruption in Hungary done by Orban.
Flagged due to sour grapes.
My guess is it's flagged by Americans (it's their daytime) who don't realize the significance of this result to the EU and potentially the EU's response to the war in Ukraine.
You know, I took a second look at it, and weirdly enough, I can't vouch it for some reason. That's odd. Grats to the good folks across the pond though! May we be so lucky when next our transition is scheduled!
> You know, I took a second look at it, and weirdly enough, I can't vouch it for some reason.
The 'vouch' option doesn't appear until/unless the post becomes [dead].
Probably flagged by MAGA and pro-Kremlin aligned accounts who dislike the results and uppercase Liberal limousine establishment Democrats who try to censor every view they don't already agree with. If these were normal times, the I'd say keep sex, religion, and politics private except not the latter when liberal democratic politicians, speech-debate, and journalism are/were under fire in many sectors and countries. I'm hoping with this result that Hungary will experience much greater press and personal freedom.. and the corruption will hopefully be exposed more widely similar to Caolan Robertson only hinting at some of the extravagant emoluments and embezzlement. https://youtu.be/HiayCdysN04
American here. I was at a party when I saw the news and gleefully announced it to the table I was sitting at. We were all pleased with both the result and the concession.
...we know.
Eh, I guess that people that flagged it know quite well what this result mean to the EU, they just hate it because they want to see the EU fail.
Probably flagged because of lack of tech relevance.
(I listen Ukraine: The Latest daily, I'm reasonably up-to-date big issue European politics).
This is a hugely important geopolitical event, and mods here often override flagging in such cases.
Here is an example of HN moderation going the other way, when it favored a right-leaning narrative:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34712496
It is getting more and more difficult for me to see moderation here as unbiased. The charitable take is that people are often not aware of their biases. I am sure I suffer from that to some extent, though I really try to go out of my way to be self-aware about this. And yes, of course this comment could be evidence of my own bias.
Exactly: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
[flagged]
[flagged]
It's an odd fascism that hadn't yet managed to take over the elections too.
This is just a straw man fallacy I keep seeing pushed around, especially on pro-Russia subs in reddit. Elections are about how you choose who takes the role, it's not about what the role is - which can be a fascist dictator with popular support. It is a popular genre in the last 10-15 years, the fascists and dictators with popular support use their control of media, police, judiciary etc to align all the odds in their favor and go ahead and hold real elections and as long as the margin is large enough they don't cheat on the elections.
Even when they loose an election they tend to have loyalists embedded deep in the institutions and take power back through sabotage and legal battles. For example, they set the governing process in such a way that it's practically impossible to effectively govern by following the rules, when they loose an election the new people are having very hard time, services start to suffer. They need to do reforms and change the laws and if they don't have supermajority they are being blocked and end up either screw up governing or follow the practical paths of governing like the previous government used to do. This results in either losing elections next time as the public sees this as incompetence or being sent into jail as judiciary selectively targets you for corruption when you take shortcuts to get things done.
So it is a fascist dictatorship even if there are elections and official power transfer because the institution than wield power follow orders to smash opponents of their leader during their reign or even after they are officially not in power.
Good. I visited Hungary years ago, and I loved the time I spent there. It saddened me a bit to see its sliding into autocracy and being relegated to be a Russian vassal state.
Hopefully the damage Orban caused to Hugarian institutions get reversed.
Welcome back to Europe, Hungary.
Time will tell. Keep in mind that his successor was part of Orban's party in the past.
From your perspective as afaik nowadays a Californian progressive: Don't let perfect be the enemy of good.
Yes, that's true. But there is enough about Magyar that I don't understand that I'm cautiously optimistic. Though it would be hard to imagine worse than Orban...
JD Vance strikes again. I wonder how long it will take US politicians and assorted billionaires to realize that their 'endorsements' will backfire.
Shhhh. Don't correct your enemy while they are busy making mistakes. Just smile and wave.
"...will take US politicians and assorted billionaires to realize that their 'endorsements' will backfire..." They may have to switch off their AI and start using their own brain - should they still have one, that is.
I don't know much about him, only that he was in the same party. I have heard that he is pro-EU and anti-Russia though, is that true?
Pro-EU: probably. Anti-Russia: also probably.
For both: I prefer to see it all rather than to assume it will be fine. Oh, and we still have Fico to deal with. But at least Hungarians have chosen against Orban that in itself gives some hope. Those leaked phone calls that were made public in the last weeks were very damning, I always assumed that such stuff was going on but to have hard proof is on another level.
I wonder what they're going to do with the participants. And what Orban's plans are now that he's in the opposition. I would not count him out just yet, he's got Putin's backing and you can bet they'll work overtime to try to destabilize Magyar's government. The rot goes pretty deep and it will take a lot of work to undo all that damage.
Orban is only 63; it's up to him what he will do but there is a certain type of people that could live happily on their own island with all the money they have stolen but they prefer to do evil to their last day. See for example Babis, delegating the ownership of his huge company to a trust fund so he can be a prime minister again at 70. Or indeed our great leader Fico who is in politics like Orban since '89, was prime minister around 15 years of the last 20, probably stolen billions for himself, was shot, nearly killed, and doesn't look like he wants to give up his power anytime soon.. and he's still only 62.
If nothing goes catastrophically wrong (again), Orban won't be allowed to return as a prime minister. One of the first legislation the new government aims to pass is to maximize the number of terms to two (8 years in power) which Orban already surpassed. Of course, they could always pull a Putin and put him in a presidential chair and shift power from the parliament/prime minister, so let's hope Fidesz never gets that level of support ever again.
That's great news.
With Orban much reduced in power Fico's days are numbered.
But Orban will hang around, if only to do more of Putin's bidding, it's up to Magyar & the new government now to deal with Orban and his spies in a way that they won't be able to do a come-back.
Not really, Fico has survived a lot during his 4 decades in politics and was always able to adapt (to our detriment). His political survival does not depend on Orban, even though they were close the last couple of years.
That's absolutely true. But in a European context he's already vowed that he will now take up Orban's mantel in blockading EU assistance to Ukraine and other tricks. That means he will no longer be able to hide his involvement and I'm pretty sure that the same kind of conversations between Lavrov and Hungarian politicians can be found about Fico & company. They are clearly not acting in Slovakia's long term interests and that's something that can be much more openly discussed. Keeping in mind that Slovakia is only 1/3rd of so of the size economy as Hungary makes it less of a problem to begin with.
Strength to you, it must be super hard to be living under politicians that are ripping off your country in such a blatant manner on behalf of what is nominally now an enemy nation (based on their own statements), especially given what your country had to endure in the years before the fall of the USSR.
I think generally western EU has no idea how unbelievably corrupt these regimes (Fico, Orbana, Babis) are... they are not stealing on behalf of Putin, they are stealing for themselves, and they are oriented towards Russia because they dream of having Putin's unchecked power.
Luckily I don't think Fico will help Putin that much because nobody trusts him anymore, his foreign minister is very weak and as you mention Slovakia is no economical heavyweight. The hardest thing for us is to see the brainwashed masses still voting for Fico or worse still actual nazis.
Yes, he basically have the same views, except on Russia. One advantage though is that Orban put his people at the head of Hungary corporations, so maybe that will end and the corruption will be kept at "normal" levels.
> A country where no one is stigmatized for loving someone differently than the majority.
-- Peter Magyar victory speech, April 12, 2026
That's directly in opposition to Orban's views and homophobic laws.
Shit, i didn't realize, his name is really Magyar? I thought it was a surname. What a name for Hungary's president
On a similar note, François Hollande had the right first name but the wrong last name!
[dead]
"Russians go home" was one of the main chants at opposition rallies. In 2026 like in 1989.
They all start from the same root whether Trump (once a democrat), BJP (part of congress, oldest political party in India)
contesting election results untruthfully always existed, but since 2021 the result is not the headline anymore, the concession is
Why is this and all other posts about this flagged?
"unpolitical" people don't like being reminded what their stance brings to
Thank god Vance showed up to support him!
Vance also knocked off Pope Francis, and the Iran deal last night. Maybe we can send him to Moscow next.
I bet Viktor felt too uncomfortable to tell him "no please don't come stay in the USA, you are political poison"
Vance is on track to replace Dan Quayle at the bottom of the Civ leader rankings.
Yes but has Orban even said thank you?
Happy for Hungary!
Unfortunatlely, half democracies (ie representative) are open to abuse and give too much power to presidents or governments. Combined with populism, lobbying and corruption, it allows people like Orban to stay in power for a long time. Glad it's over.
Happy for Hungary, the EU, the planet. The sooner the world falls out of love with populism and illiberalism, the better.
It really feels like the tides are turning against the cancer that is populism.
Ooooh. I didn't think it would happen. This disturbs the balance a bit.
which balance? orban was a parasite, trying to embezzle as much money from the EU without getting the boot (hungary as the biggest per-head receiver of EU funds), while probably also getting paid by russia - a hostile actor - for his actions (i.e. sabotaging the union and sowing dissent through propaganda). there was no balance there.
OK then, some other metaphor to say it allows things to change and allows escape from a static situation. It releases the brakes?
It all seems so easy, despite the efforts of Putin and the US to support a guy that was there for almost two decades. I wonder if the incumbent party is, somehow, in the pocket of those fascists. I have a hard time accepting they’d just shrug and move on from being able to control a puppet state that’s the thorn in EU’s side.
Any reason not to be so cynical? I am unfamiliar with the details of Hungarian politics, but I can’t help wondering if it is staged. And why would Orbán just roll over after all this time in power?
> I have a hard time accepting they’d just shrug and move on from being able to control a puppet state that’s the thorn in EU’s side.
What can they realistically do? Invade Hungary?
> And why would Orbán just roll over after all this time in power?
What can he realistically do? A coup? With such a devastating defeat this would only lead to massive protests, which would completely ruin his political career. Meanwhile he can take a step back and think how to get back to the game in the next election.
As bad as Orban was, and as manipulated the election process was, he always won using legit votes. Which was both his strength and his weakness.
I knew the projections were looking really grim for Orban after watching JD Vance putting Trump on speakerphone five days ago during his Hungary visit. That was awkward.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GUoCvIMrgc
They must be really tired of winning by now.
What? 4$ gas until November Mr.President? Who doesn’t love paying 30% more for Gas out of their pocket for a war that is already won. Tremendous work Mr. President. A capital V victory.
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Gosh, financial support for one of the candidates by an outsider would be horrible, right? https://truthsocial.com/@realDonaldTrump/posts/1163823353301...
> My Administration stands ready to use the full Economic Might of the United States to strengthen Hungary’s Economy, as we have done for our Great Allies in the past, if Prime Minister Viktor Orbán and the Hungarian People ever need it. We are excited to invest in the future Prosperity that will be generated by Orbán’s continued Leadership! President DONALD J. TRUMP
edit: OP's post originally complained that this was Soros's fault.
Let's see Trump standing by his word and help strengthen Hungary's economy now that the Russian Stooge has lost. So much for that continued leadership.
I imagine some Euroskeptics are happy too.
I'm not too bothered if Hungary is in the EU or not but I wasn't a fan of the pro Putin stuff.
Judging by the election results, it was a populist ouster.
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You can just move on instead of furthering your own point.
just click [flag]
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I have not read much about this issue, but I wonder if it is as serious as you are saying why are populations across Europe not voting against it, or they are voting but getting ignored by the rulers?
> or they are voting but getting ignored by the rulers?
That is what happened in at least:
- the Netherlands (votes for Wilders)
- Sweden (votes for SD)
- Germany (votes for AfD)
- France (votes for whatever that party is called nowadays)
- the UK (votes for Brexit largely based around migration issues)
- Belgium (votes for Vlaams Blok)
- Italy (votes for Meloni)
- Austria (votes for FPÖ)
...and I can go on. In most countries in Europe voters have spoken out against what they consider to be excessive asylum-based migration from non-Western cultures without requirements regarding assimilation or integration but not much has happened politically until very recently when the EU parliament voted to increase deportation efforts [1]. It remains to be seen whether this law will have any measurable impact given the fact that the EU actively supports many NGOs which aim to achieve the opposite of what the law states.
[1] https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/2026/03/26/eu-parliament-...
Can we please stop with the 'great replacement theory' drivel?
You seem to want to drop that into conversations even though it is patent bullshit.
Thank you.
> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47666504
> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47521089
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